LF Prison Ministry Podcast-

Such an honor and a blessing to be able to speak into your life. They're on the Pando app on your tablet. What a blessing that is. Again, my name's Logan Williams. My TDC numbers 1490218. That's not the only number I have. I've got four more numbers after that. Round and round and round in the system. Look, the criminal justice system, drugs, crime. Just kept leading me back, leading me back, leading me back. And many of you know that isn't your first time there that once you go, it's really easy to go back, man. And it's just what happened to me over and over and over again. Understand the frustration, the disappointment, the anxiety, the, "Gosh, here we go again." Like, "Is this it?" Like, "Is this-- am I ever going to figure this life thing out?" And I want to encourage you, man. No, the answer's no. You're not going to figure it out. But he's already got it figured out. He has a plan and a purpose for your life that's greater than anything you can think, ask or imagine. All you have to do is say yes to him and get all the way in. Get all in. It doesn't do any good to get in 90%. That's what I found because I tried that. He needs all of us. We all have a plan.

We have a calling on our life. Guys, every single one of you have a calling on your life. Whether you believe that or not, it says the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable in Romans 11, 29. That means that calling that he has, it can't be revoked. It's irrevocable. It can't be trans-- it can't be taken away or edited or changed or it's not like he changes his mind. But we have to step into that calling. We have to get all in. I want to tell you, man, that you can do this. You can do this. Hey, tell your friends and family. They can download the same Pando app on their phone that you watch. You can watch the same teachings, the same church services. Read the same books. The chosen is on there. The Bible recap is so many amazing things are on there. They didn't have the Pando app when I was locked up. But man, what a blessing it is for you guys. So you can tell your friends and family. And y'all can watch the same things. And you can talk about it when you see each other in visitation or when you're on the phone or take a few minutes. Hey, what did the Holy Spirit say to you about that message? And y'all can do this thing together. We're never meant to do this walk alone. And so I want to encourage you in that. We love you guys.

And I know you've heard many pastors up here say, you're not just a project to us. You're part of our church family. Man, we believe that. And we mean that. And any of your prayer requests that you sent in get prayed over by two or three different prayer teams that meet and specifically pray. We spread them out up here on Saturday mornings at seven o'clock for a prayer meeting. And it's just like two hours. People walking all over the church, walking all over the sanctuary, just praying. And many times they'll come up and just lay their hands and pray over your prayer requests as well. I want you to know that, man, we're really invested. And so if you get out and even though you don't live here but you're anywhere near the Dallas Fort Worth Metroplex on a Sunday, man, we would love to just meet you. We would love to introduce you to everyone and man, get you a coffee, take you to lunch, whatever. We just wanna do life with you. And man, it's like every week, it's like eight or 10 in a row. I've gotten to meet one of you guys that have come. And it's such a blessing. It blesses us so much, man. So please come find us at Life Fellowship, Church in McKinney. Man, I wanna encourage y'all. Man, the Word of God is just, it's amazing.

It's just that double edged sword that it talks about. And I don't know how it really works for you, but God will have me in a certain set of scriptures and he'll just have me there for a while. And the past week or so, it's been John seven after I got to teach to the young adult group. Man, I've just been steady in those verses and I just wanted to share a few of them with you today 'cause I think they'll help you. I'm gonna start in verse 10. So Jesus goes down to the feast of tabernacles in verse 10, it says, "However, after his brothers had gone up to the feast, he also went up, not publicly but secretly." a man at the pool of Bethesda that had been laying there paralyzed for 38 years and like forget all of that, they're just mad because it happened on the Sabbath and he actually told this man to pick up his mat and walk. And so they totally look past the fact that some dude that had been laying there and couldn't move for 38 years is now healed, forget that he's actually carrying his bed on the Sabbath. Who told you to do that? And so that began this conspiracy to try to kill Jesus, man, and so he's going secretly because he don't want to get killed. It wasn't his appointed time. So then the Jews looked for him at the feast and said, "Where is he?" Verse 12, "There was much complaining among the people concerning him, for some said he's a good man." Others said, "No, he deceives the people." Yet no one spoke openly of him for fear of the Jews. They don't want to get out there. The government wants to kill this guy, so I ain't saying nothing about him.

I don't want to get on their hit list, right? So he goes, people are talking, some say he's a good man, some say he deceives people, strikes man. It's just like today, right? Probably just like in the facility that you're at. I don't know where you're at. We're in two million tablets across America, and I think we're even in Philippines now. But there's good places and there's, well, there's bad places and there's worse places. And hopefully you're not in one of the worst places. But maybe you are. But wherever you're at, you're going to have people that are saying the same thing. They're going to have opinions about him. So we're going to say, "Yeah, he's God, he's the Messiah, he's a good man." Others are going to say, "No, man, it's smoke, he deceives people, whatever." Just like today, it was happening back then. Same Jesus, same miracles, same word, same teachings, different opinions. And so it's important because if we're going to follow Jesus or if we're thinking about following Jesus, or, and I'm just going to tell you, if you're watching this video today, like the Lord is after you, okay? It's not just a coincidence that you're watching this today. And a doubt you're going to get away because when he's after us, he comes after us. But it's important, man, to ask that question, what do you believe? Because we live in this world filled with competing voices, right? Some people say he's good, some people say he's not, I mean, you're going to have Muslim friends that are going to say, "Oh yeah, we know Jesus, but we like Jesus, but he's not God." You know, all these things. He was just a good teacher. Christianity's outdated. You can't trust the Bible, all that.

But you know what? Some are going to say, "He Jesus is Lord." Some are going to say that. So eventually, everyone has to decide, the people that it was just writing about have to decide, just like I had to decide, just like you have to decide. Are you going to build your opinion, are you going to build your understanding of Jesus on popular opinion, or are you going to build your understanding of Jesus on what Jesus actually says about himself? And so, and this, look, let's just get this out of the way. Do you believe that the Word of God is the truth? You got to answer that question. Is this truth? And am I willing to get all in with this? Because the first hurdle is just believing that it's the truth. But then it's like, man, but to get all in, man, to actually wage war against my sin, to actually lay it all down, that's an entirely different thing. So is this the truth? If the answer is not yes, pray about it. God, give me revelation. Help me. I want to believe. Help my unbelief. That's in here. I got prayed that. So what are you going to build your understanding on verse 14? Now about the middle of the festival, Jesus went up to the temple and began teaching. The Jews marveled, saying, "How has this man become educated? How has this man become educated, having never been taught?" So he's being profound. He's saying some amazing things, and they're like, "This dude ain't sat under no rabbi.

This dude ain't been trained. How in the world is he speaking like this?" The religious leaders are amazed. How does he have such learning? Because he's never been taught. And so back then, you know, you would have these rabbis that would, you know, preach or Like they would hear one rabbi, I mean, look, you guys, some of you are leaders in the church in the facility that you're at, sometimes you'll go on panda, you'll hear somebody say some really profound statement about a scripture, man, that's good. And so you'll repeat it, you know? It's the same thing that they're doing back then, you know? We all do that, you know? Because I guarantee you, whoever you repeated it from, he's just repeating it, like nothing's original, right? And so, but they're repeating what these rabbis, they would hear them teach, and then they would say something else, and then maybe another rabbi would hear that, and they would repeat it, that's kind of how they sharpen each other, is that way. But see, the thing is, Jesus didn't quote any of the rabbis, none of them. He wasn't a product of their religious educational system, his answer was powerful when he heard them saying this. He said, "My teaching's not of my own, it comes from the one who sent me." That's verse 16. It says, "Jesus answered that my teaching is not mine, but he who sent me, "If any man desires to do his will, he shall know whether the teaching is from God, or whether I speak on my own authority." I want to go back to 16. "My teaching is not of my own, it comes from the one who sent me." I'm just, do you guys ever do this? I always envision myself, like, back in the day, like if I just happened to have been born 2,000 years ago, and I'm rolling around, I'm just a regular dude, right?

A shepherd, or a potmaker, or whatever it is that they do. Here comes Jesus, and he starts speaking, and I think to myself, "Man, what I believe, what I be one of those that believed." I would like to think that I would, especially after witnessing all the miracles, but we really don't know, because there seems to be so many people that don't. Do you ever ask yourself that question? If you heard him say that, "My teaching is not of my own, it comes from one who sent me." If you were living back then and heard that, okay, how would you respond to a statement like that? Would you believe that God sent him? How are you responding right now? Because that's all that matters, guys, is how we're responding right now in this moment. That doesn't matter how we responded last month, last week, last year, but today, the Word of God today, how am I responding to it? If you're not sure, verse 17 gives us a really tremendous principle. It says, "Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God." Another translation of that says, "Anyone who wants to do the will of God wants to do the will of God will find out whether it comes from Him." So it's like, "Do you want to do the will of God?" It's back to my question of, "Are you willing to get all in?" Do you want to do the will of God? And I know for us, man, like, look at the order that Jesus puts it in. It's like, for me, I want to sometimes get, I want to understand everything, I want to get it all figured out, get it all lined out, okay, now I'm going to hear it, now I'm going to trust, now I'm going to believe. I've already got it all understood, and what Jesus is saying, no, no, no, trust me, obey now, and then the understanding will come. It's backwards from what our fleshly brain wants to tell us, and I want to encourage

you today with that, man. What is he asking you to do? What is he asking you to lay down? According to the scripture, we're going to get the understanding after we obey. Someone who wants to do the will of God will then understand. So I want to encourage you, man, he's saying, "Trust me, obey, and then you'll get your understanding." Oftentimes, these things, man, excuse me, they don't make sense to us. I know when I came back off of a horrible drug run, man, and God called me out of that hotel room, many of you heard my testimony, and I took that step and gave away a bunch of drugs, man, which is so hard for a guy like me to do with the enemy screaming at me, man, you know you're going to not stay clean. Why are you giving those away? You're wasting it. You're stupid. I did that, man. I thought, wow, I just did something amazing. And then he hits me like a week later with, I want you to lay down sexual sin. I want you to stop having sex with this girl that you're not married to, because that's my beloved daughter, and you're leading her down a path of destruction at all, and he wasn't happy about it. That didn't make sense to me. And to lay this other thing down is going to even make that thing harder, I thought. And so I'm like, man, what is happening? It doesn't make sense. But are you willing to obey in the moment to the things that don't make sense to your brain, to your human brain, your fleshly brain, that doesn't make sense?

Then the understanding comes. Because when I did say yes to that, the thing that pushed me over that cliff, because when we make these hard decisions, I don't know about you, but for me, it feels like I'm jumping off a cliff sometimes. It was imagine what your life could be like if you just got all the way in with me one time. Imagine what your life could be like, guys, if you just got all the way in with him one time. I'm guessing since you're sitting in the place you're sitting, you've never been all in before. You may have thought that you had, but you always hung on to something. God doesn't want 90% of us. He wants 100% of us. He wants all of us. And that goes back to that calling I was talking about. Imagine what your calling could actually be. The Bible says it's cedingly and abundantly above all we can think or ask. Do you believe that? But it's gonna take us getting all in and making those difficult decisions before we can necessarily understand it. Does that make sense? So I wanna encourage you with that. Those verses 17 being the key one. If any man desires to do the will of God, he shall know whether my teaching comes from him.

Guys, man, have a moment with God. Ask him what you're hanging on to. Ask him to search you out, and like David did, and to know you, and anything that offends him to bring it to the surface, into the light, where he can sever that thing from you, where he can heal that stuff from you. Because imagine, guys, what your life could be like. If you just got all the way in one time, man, he's got an amazing plan for you. I don't care where you're at. I don't care how big of a sentence you have. He can use you, man, right where you're at. And he has a plan for your future that you can't even imagine. But it takes making those difficult decisions right now. Father, we love you, and I pray for all of these men and women who are watching God. I pray that, man, your Holy Spirit would just have a moment with their hearts this week, that you would just reveal, man, that you would just convict. I just feel like there's many people that were just like me when I was in prison. Yeah, we went to church, and yeah, I did the, check the boxes, but I just wanted to be comfortable so I could just get through that difficult time. And I just feel, God, that there's many that are right there on the edge, that have given 90%, but they haven't given their all. And so God, I pray, man, for those people, that they could somehow find a way to get all in,

that they could somehow get a glimpse or a vision from you of what their future could be, of how the amazing things you want to do to use them, man, to make much of your name and to enlarge your kingdom, and how awesome that is, how just that feeling can't be touched, like that joy, being in the lane that God designed you to be in. So God, I pray that if anyone is watching that has losing hope, God, I pray that you would just restore that, man, I pray that you would, that you would light a fire in them to let them know that you're not finished with them yet, that of all the friends that they have, all the friends that I have who've overdosed through, who have been shot or dead, man, I should be one of those, but for whatever reason, they're not. And God, I just know that you're not done, you're not finished. As long as we're fogging a mirror, you still have a plan and a purpose for us. And God, I pray that that encourages somebody today. And so we love you, God, and we praise your name, we thank you just for this technology and just for the ability to all come together and speak life to one another. God, I pray that you would bless their families while they're gone, that you'd be a provider to their families, their friends, their loved ones, their kids, their elderly parents, all the things that we worry about when we're locked up.

And God, I pray that you would just remove that anxiety that they could focus on you, that they could just fix their eyes on you in a way that they never have before, God. some praise welcome men and women to the life fellowship prison ministry podcast my name is Logan Williams my TDC numbers 149 0 2 1 8 I just share that because I've been there and I've been rounded around because I have four numbers after that this is my good friend Robert Hernandez his TDC number is two four nine so I'm just kidding he doesn't really have a TDC number and this is Roberto another good friend of mine that helps me out in the prison ministry he works here in facilities Robert here is actually the connections pastor at our north campus and so we're we don't really know what we're doing today we're just here to encourage you and to we know you like podcast type recordings and so we're just here to hopefully entertain you but at the same time bring you some truth we want to give you some nuggets that you can take away from this and so that that can help you grow in your relationship with Christ even in the place that you're at yep sounds good to me so Robert tell us a little bit about your story um I mean we know about your story we know you but they don't know you so tell us just a little bit about who you are and then we'll dig into I got I got some questions okay cool my name is Robert Hernandez and when Logan started going TDC I was like oh no I don't I had there was enough no okay so there's a little bit of humor involved and it was more of those thing of like hey here's what we're going to do and we just want to help bring a word and encourage so a couple of weeks ago mr. Roberto and mr. Logan came to me and they were like hey we just want you to share your story it's not your your typical like good church pastor story so we want to hear it and so I was like okay so just dive in straight in my dad was an abusive alcoholic growing up was a really scary time for me I learned from a very early age you got to learn to read the room you got to understand what's happening at home because dad could be in a good place dad could be in a bad place I was really close with my mom my mom was my guardian and my protector but she was a tiny five foot nothing blonde hair blue white girl and my dad was a little bit bigger guy and so it was like how do I read the room how do I walk in safety and just all of the stress that I had growing up you guys want me to go and dig into like the hard stuff or is there a time for that sure go ahead okay so my very first memory is actually driving home my mom is my mom is driving we stop at the store we were poor it was

usually you can have a coke or a Reese's you couldn't have both and Reese's was my candy and she goes hey you can have both tonight I haven't got excited we're driving home and she's shaking and she goes hey if your dad asked you to go anywhere tonight just tell him you want to stay here with me and I said okay I'm like five six years old and we get home I go straight to my room I had one of those little you like pop it you turn and that's how you change channels I'm sitting watching TV and my door flies open slams against the wall and my dad just comes in and he starts yelling at me he goes come on let's go and I go to know I want to be here with mom I want to stay and he goes no let's go and I go to know I want to stay with mom and he yells something and then he grabs me by the back of my shirt and he drags me down the hallway and I just remember as a young kid just choking with my shirt against my throat he picks me up by my shirt slams me into the couch and just starts yelling at me you know when I said go we need to go and why didn't you have your mom call me or did it and I was like dad I don't know I forgot I just remember being terrified and seeing my mom behind him going hey Rudy let's let's go talk let's go let's go have a conversation in the back bedroom he yells at her turns around and slams his fist into the wall and I don't remember anything after that and that was my first memory and when people look back at their childhood and they're like we did this and we did this I'm like I never had that but I do know that from that moment not only was I afraid of my dad but in this really weird way of wanting to be closer to him I really wanted his approval and my dad loved football so I loved football and then he got me involved in Peewee and they gave me a football nickname and it was Thumper and I was always trying to like earn my father's love whether I was on the football field or whether I was later on in high school pursuing women like I was always looking for his approval in a new way and then going through high school still in football and then I just remember going I don't want to do this anymore I want to go into a different sport and going to my dad and saying hey I'm kind of done with this sport and just he just didn't show up for wrestling at all so I wanted to My parents got divorced when I was 11 and so I didn't see him a lot anyway and so I would play football he'd show up but when I'd wrestle nothing and I just remember being by this point I'm a freshman in high school going I really wish my dad loved me and then going through high school and getting fit and good looking which has lost some of that appeal over time but I just remember going man now that like I can like get girls then I would call my dad and be like oh I was I was with this girl and I was with this girl and and for a little while he sounded proud of me again

and so then I finished high school and I actually wound up becoming a ballroom dance instructor because I had built fences and installed alarm systems and hated being hot and sweaty and also I like the view a lot more with beautiful women in ballroom dancing so I called my dad and I'm like hey I'm actually a ballroom dance instructor and my dad being who he is goes great I raised a gay kid and he hung up and I was like no like they needed to talk to me for another year and I was like I would call him and leave voicemails and he just never would answer and it just took me back to growing up right after my parents getting divorced and him never showing up so a lot of my childhood wasn't in safety and in health and in good places a lot of my childhood was really going I really wish my dad loved me like he said he did how did that affect just as you became a believer like like you hear people they put they put God's face on their father's face and it can be a huge barrier to just knowing who you are how much the father loves you and just having that relationship with our father the perfect father yeah how did you overcome that so we actually grew up at Jehovah's Witness or I did my mom and I and then when my dad was acting like this my mom and I would occasionally go to kingdom hall but really that was it so by the time I get into high school and then out of high school I'm an atheist by this point I didn't want anything to do with these Christians and so from the age of about 17 to 26 I was an atheist I always thought Jesus was a construct you people made up to feel good about dying and so I start my own ballroom dance company I'm doing okay in business I have a bad week and a business consultant who had come to me said I do everything according to biblical principle I said oh great you're one of those people and they continued to challenge me they'd come in and I'd go okay what does your bible say about this and they would defend it with history and facts and when Jesus said you know render under Caesar what is Caesar's talking about bringing money to the temple that was the Caesar I had read about in school I can argue thoughts and ideas all day but then that was real history and so had a bad week decided to go to the church with my mentor and realized Jesus may be real but I don't really know yet but I noticed the men in that church campus were men who loved God who loved their families who really wanted to be good men and so I said weren't you guys go to learn to do this and they said oh they went to this retreat I said okay I'll give anything a shot once so I go to this retreat still atheist view and then I reach into the cup holder and I find a penny and I pull it out it's got my birth year on it and for the first time ever I hear God's voice and he says do you know how hard it is to get all of the minerals pulled from the earth to get

that penny minted for it to change hands these last 26 years of your life do you know how hard that is and I said no and he goes and you were completely worth it so at that moment realizing God is real and wants a real relationship with me that was a radical transformation of my life so it happened on a men's retreat yeah that's I remember five years ago a little over five years ago when I got saved and I got sober I went on a men's retreat that's where I met Robert and I didn't know what to expect I didn't know what was about to happen I just wanted to you know had this radical experience with God and I'm gonna do whatever door opens and all the leaders would share a little bit about themselves before the retreat and I remember when he shared he'd mentioned he'd been on like 60 or 70 he had served on like 60 or 70 of these retreats and that's like to me I was like that is an unbelievable number these are like five day retreats I mean he spent years on this and so now I can see why because that's where he had his experience and and it's no it's no coincidence that he All the marriage retreats, the men's retreats, the women's retreats, that is his calling, that is his passion. I want to remind each and every one of you that there is a calling that God has on your life. And if you would have asked him back before he met his business consultant, gosh, he got saved through your business consultant, that's so cool. If you would have asked him before that, hey, you're going to leave men's retreats and that's going to be the fire that God put, he would be like, you're crazy. So God, guys, I want you to know, man, he has a calling for you. It's going to be something that you maybe can't even fathom or imagine right now. But it's there and Romans 11.29 says that it's irrevocable. It can't be taken away or changed or omitted or like, that's what God's word says about your calling. And so I just want to encourage you guys with that. Yeah, so Robert, with all that trauma that happened to you growing up and longing for your father's approval and love, what did you feel like you had to become to survive? What did you, obviously, there was a bunch of grief and disappointment and just sorrow and everything that's in that same realm?

What did you feel like you had to become to survive, to basically overlap all that and suppress all that? Yeah, I felt like I had to be the best at everything. I felt like the only time my dad really looked at me with approval was when I was doing good. When I was a star football player, he smiled at me. When he finally showed up to a wrestling match and saw that it was hard and it was tough and guys are breaking arms and stuff, he was like, okay, and that was the only time it felt like he really loved me. And so when it came time to looking for God, kind of putting the face as Pastor Logan said, putting the face of my earthly father on the face of my Heavenly Father, I thought that God was always just mildly disappointed in me and I had to perform to make God happy. That's just not his heart. So what was the truth that kind of broke that thought free? It was picking up that penny and when God said those words to me, being able to look at it and go, I'm worth it all. I'm worth every drop of blood that he shed on the cross for me. It was that understanding now, what I missed in my story was I was a bartender at one point and you have what's called top shelf liquor and that's the most expensive, the best kind and in that moment, Holy Spirit spoke to me and he goes, your top shelf, you're the best and it was like, here I am at the worst part of my life, here I am chasing after everything of the world, feeling like I'm dead on the inside and Jesus goes, you're worth it all to me. Yeah, do you ever feel like some of those traumas creep back up whenever you're going through something and how do you kind of wrestle with it, how do you, what's a practical way to just surrender it, what's a practical way to heal, do you hear what I'm asking? Yeah, I'd say for me, sometimes those moments usually call them sonship or orphan part moments and a lot of times I go through something and it comes out with them when I'm with my wife sometimes, we'll be talking, we'll have a conversation and I'll just get annoyed, you know, well, you know, I'm the one clean, I'm the one, and it's like, hang on, is this really what's needed in this moment or is this more, you know, I'm just having a rough

moment and I need to breathe? I think sometimes when anybody says, hey, I'm going to do this for you and then they don't, man, that takes me back to that moment with my dad where he said, hey, I'll pick you up on Saturday and then he just no-called, no-showed, how do I move through it now? It's one of those things of going, let me take a step back mentally, maybe I need to breathe, maybe I need to slow down and go, is this really of my father's heart right now or is this the enemy, just like scripture says, throwing a fiery dart at me? Yeah, does something happen to you as a boy? I mean, obviously things have happened to you as a boy, but like, what are some promises that you quietly made to yourself, like, I'll never allow them to do this to me, I'll never do X, Y, and Z, like, those inner vows, what are the inner vows that you made to yourself and how did you get over them because I feel like a lot of the guys here, they went through a childhood experience or, actually, I read a stat earlier, 63%, almost two-thirds of people have gone through at least, have had at least one childhood trauma event happen to them and I think the devil will tell us that, he'll lie to us and tell us that we're the only one that this is happening to. God doesn't love you because you got molested or abused, physically abused, sexually abused, whatever and the truth is that almost two-thirds of people, so out of us three here, chances are two of us have been, have had some childhood trauma traumatic event. that a lot of these guys may have also made and then what was the truth that set that free? - Yeah, one of the ones was Dad never showing up and so one of those vows was I'm gonna do it on my own. I don't need anybody else. I don't need to be this vulnerable place and continuously be let down. Another one was I was molested as a child and I was like I'll never let another person have this much power over me. And so as I went to go do sports and everything else,

it was how do I be the best, the strongest, the fastest so that nobody can ever do those things to me again? And then going on that retreat and realizing I keep trying to walk everything out myself. I keep trying to be the best, the strongest, the fastest and in reality. God wants me to call on him to be my strength, to be with me, to be my protected guardian. And so it was a breaking of those vows in re-centering my life on him. You know, that was one of the things that I learned on that retreat, the biggest impact for me. You mentioned you had this like you had to perform for God and I had the realization that man, he will meet us right where we're at. Like he's not waiting on some future better version of ourselves, it's not like he said, "Hey, when you become Pastor Logan, then I'll love you." No, no, no, he met me right in my sin, in my mess and everything that I was doing. He was just waiting for me to take one step out of the pig pin, he came running to me. And that is where we need to have in our hearts, not just in our minds as information, it needs to be revelation in our hearts that God loves us, man, just because he loves us. And if we need proof of that, just look at the blood-stained cross that even on our worst day, even, guys, some of you, we've done some horrible things.

I got four numbers, I've been down there. I've done a lot of drugs and crime. And on our worst days, when we have nothing to do with him, he still looked down and said, "That's my beloved." He's worthy of dying for. While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. We gotta get that love in our hearts. It's not up to how we perform or how many Bible studies we did this week. Or, "Oh, I didn't pray this week. Maybe God's not gonna love me as much on Friday as he did on Monday." Also, and then I don't do this thing. Oh, I did that thing. I know he hates that. So now I'm gonna need two more good weeks of coming to church and not cussing, smoking, drinking, dipping, all watching pornography. And then maybe when I get to that day, he'll love me again. And that's just not the case. That the enemy wants us to be. And I say that because I know there's many that are watching that have this mindset. Guys, he just loves you. And when you get that, okay, now this produces a desire in you to want to not sin, to want to live a righteous life. We don't do that so that he loves us. We realize how much he loves us. And then the only logical response is to go and try to live a righteous life.

And that's what I took away from that retreat as well. - Yeah. One thing I'm big on is a lot of people use Christianity for self-improvement, like a spiritual self-improvement program or for behavior modification. And it's not about that. Like I just think that's a surface level. Like behavior is a surface problem. But what you really gotta do is go deeper and unpack the, open the box in your heart of the traumas and that happened to you and get real and honest, why the Bible says confess your sins to one another and pray for one another 'cause the righteous man, I mean, the pray of a righteous man accomplished as much because that's how you get healing. Even times that I've told Logan about things that I just need to get off my chest. There's nothing that he can do about it is just getting it off my chest and confessing it to him. There's healing in that. And I walk away from that conversation so much freer. Not that anything changed necessarily, but my chest is lighter, my heart is lighter. So. - Yeah. - And to go on and to meet the point of what you guys were both saying was it's a process. It's a day by day thing. It's not about being sinless, but I hope that each week I sin less.

And one of the things is my wife and I recently, it's like, where are we gonna be in the Bible? And we went to Ecclesiastes. And in Ecclesiastes three, it talks about a time, a season for everything, a season to plant, a season to reap, a season to embrace, a season to refrain from embracing or holding, a season to live, a season to die, a season to cry, a season to be happy. And it's that thing of God created the world and it's seasons fall, winter, spring, all the summer. And you've got these different portions of life and it's the same thing in our walk with Christ. It's everything is a process. Everything is a season if we drop the ball here. It's okay, let's keep moving. It's not about being able to be perfect. It's about picking it up and continuing to walk day by day. Do you all think healing is a place that you arrive to? Like is it a destination that you arrive at? Or do you think we'll ultimately always have a hole in our heart until we get to heaven? Are we ultimately healed once we get to heaven, of course? But is it possible to be fully healed here on Earth? I think there was a beautiful picture I was listening to a pastor he was talking about. He had gotten a fight with his wife. And as he was leaving, Holy Spirit gave him this image. And he showed him completely covered in dirt and mud and sticks and brain.

It looked like he'd gotten out and rolled in the mud. And the image was of Jesus having a washcloth and just cleaning a little bit and then dipping the washcloth and cleaning a little bit. And he knew in that moment it was going to take a lifetime of cleaning for him to be clean. So I think healing is an area that we walk out a little bit more. But I don't think we ever get to a place here on Earth where it's like, no, I walk in complete healing. I think it's like I find healing here, here, here and here. I think over time you come to those realizations less because you're more healed than you are hurt. And I feel like a lot of times these childhood wounds, these father wounds or whatever it is that you're dealing with, for me I'm really looking at codependency right now and controlling things. And we can have moments, yes, where we're healed, where we are restored. But then as we walk this out, I just know in my life, maybe there's a couple of week period that I'm super busy, super stressed. I don't spend as much time with him. I'm a little bit off spiritually. And then something could happen that could trigger those wounds that, yes, I was healed from, but I'm having a reaction to it again because I'm not maybe as spiritually fit as I should be. And this is just life on planet Earth, man. But thank God I have people around me that can point it out

and say, hey, man, I'm seeing this in you. People that I've given permission to, spiritual consent is what I call it, to speak into my life. And I just wanna encourage you, if you don't have, Robert was mentioning confessing your sins to one another, praying for another, so you may be healed. Man, if you don't have one of those people around you in the facility that you're at, all you need is one. Like-minded person that you can do this walk with and you can practice James 516 with, if you don't have that man, pray and ask God to bring you that person. It has been the main weapon in my, sobriety in my walk with Christ. - Yeah, what about you? What were some inner vows that you made through some childhood experiences? Man, let me think. I would say, yeah, I'm never gonna trust anyone. I'm never gonna trust a female. I got hurt when I was a little kid. I'm never gonna trust him. I'm never, you know, and my childhood was not bad. I had parents that worked all the time. They were not believers, but I was pretty spoiled. I didn't have any trauma. I was a troublemaker. I would do anything I could do to get attention. And so, yeah, that would be some of my vows would be,

I have to stand out. I have to be the life of the party. If you knew who I really was, you wouldn't like me. And then when I got hurt by that female, it was I'm never trusting another woman. - Yeah, I've been doing a lot of study into freedom and what it is and what it is not. And I think the ultimate conclusion that I came to is freedom is the ability to operate in full transparency and to not have anything hidden. One of the things I would have to say, and I stole it from Toby Slough. He's a great healing battery. - Well, he stole it from someone, so. - He probably stole it from him. - We all were stealing everything from him. - I mean, I'm a thief of greatness. So whatever it is that makes someone great, I'm gonna steal and apply it to my life. But he says that the world lied to you and tell you that if you're fully known, you can't be fully loved. But the truth is that you can't be fully loved until you're fully known. And how many people, I would say 99% of people walk around with something that they're hiding and something that they don't just lay everything out. They're just not fully themselves. And they may say they are, but subconsciously, I think in our humanity, we're always hiding something.

And what we really need to do is allow the Holy Spirit to open our hearts and to dig through all that baggage and get all that baggage out, because again, back to my conclusion, freedom is the ability to operate in total transparency is what I believe is what I believe it is, whether that's right or wrong, I don't know. Yeah, it is. It's also, you know, the Bible says that we're free from sin, but then as we walk it out, it's like, doesn't seem like I'm free from sin, but it does say that in the Bible. But I think the freedom comes that when we do sin, like, what are we doing about it? Does it bother you when you sin? When I think about freedom, you know, I think about my life as a drug addict. I was hopelessly just addicted. I could not stop. I could see the train wreck coming. I still couldn't stop. I didn't care. I just wanted to keep this thing going as long as I could. So there's freedom from those things, which many of you are dealing with. You're attempting to get the freedom. Many of you are in there for drugs. Many of you are in there. You're high right now. There are drugs in the facilities that you're at. I always thought if I just came to church, there'd be a magic wand waved over me and I would get this freedom and I would get this righteousness and it takes some work, man. It takes some work with you and the Holy Spirit and usually another man, if you're a man or a woman, if you're a woman, another godly person to walk this thing out with you. Freedom is it's elusive. It's, you know, one day we could be free from anger the next day. Again, it could just pop back up on us. It's like whack-a-mole at Chuck E. Cheese I found. I just had a good question. That's okay. I can feel it. Go ahead. So I like that, you know, freedom is walking in full transparency and I like this idea that Pastor Logan was talking about, which is we walk in grace as well. The woman that was caught in adultery, she was brought before Jesus and Jesus at the end of this looks at her and he goes, "Where are your accusers?" And she goes, "I have done." And he goes, "Neither do I condemn you. Go and send no more." And it was this idea of grace is like, "Hey, you fell. You made a mistake. You dropped it. It's okay." But go and send no more. Go and do better. Go and walk in the way of his freedom more. Grace is like, "Hey, I made a mistake and it's okay. We're going to get through it. But let's go up every time we fall instead of I fell. So I'm going to stay there." Yeah. So let me ask you, Robert, what do you do so many intensive events

serve on them? What do you, do you get filled up? Do you have realizations? Do you like, why do you continue to do that other than it's your calling? But what benefits do you have? Do you find that you get, do you get new revelations? Do you get, have you ever had another layer peeled off that you didn't even see coming? Or tell me about just the benefit of all those intensives that you... The holes. So when Pastor Logan went through, I was 60 or 70 events. Now I've served on 124 over the last 10 years. Do you track them? Do you count them? I do. Yeah. So especially like once I hit 100, I'm like, "Oh, what are we on? How many did I do?" And it became, there was a point of pride at one point and now it's more like, "No, like this is the thing I did because I feel called." But the whole reason I came back was two things. One, just what Pastor Logan was saying, "Every time I go on an event, I have another layer stripped away. I have new insight, new revelation, not just into people's hearts, but into my Heavenly Father's heart. How much more God loves me, how much more God is wild about me, not when I serve on an event, but how much He loves me every single day." And that was just layer one. Layer two was surrounding myself with godly people. And I loved when you were talking about, "Get you that one person because that one person doesn't even have to have the right answer." I really, when I go to a brother and say, "Hey, man, I really need some prayer." I don't need him to have the perfect word. I need him to hear me. I need to feel like I was understood. And then I need him to pray with me. And going on these events surrounded me with godly men who love their wives, who love their families, who were flawed men, but men who wanted to grow with Christ. And that's what drew me back. Yeah. I mean, I can just tell you, my experience, having been in recovery, failing and succeeding and failing and succeeding for a couple of decades. I had that, but then when I got saved and I went on this event and now I have a group of men around me, when I would have those moments where I would fall or what I would maybe reach out to an old friend or an old, I remember this one time I reached out to an old female that I'd used with just a couple of months prior and had sexual sin with and all that stuff. It was very tempting for me to go back to that, you know, I call my recovery friends and they're always just What is wrong with you? You need to, you're selfish. You need to, and then when I called my brothers, man, it was completely different.

It was, it was, hey man, just the fact that you're confessing this right now shows me that the Spirit of God is in you. You are a mighty man of God. You are a warrior. You are, and then they prayed over me. And like, I needed that, bro. I needed someone to just speak that life into me. In that moment, it was so key. - Yeah, did you guys ever struggle with identity? Not like, am I female or my daughter or whatever, but like, in the sense that like, I did these things, but the moment I confess Jesus as my Lord and Savior, I got, I received a new identity. I'd have to become, I didn't have to come into a new identity. I didn't have to perform for an identity or work for an identity. I just received a new one. Was that like a hard thing to grasp for you guys? Was that like, I know the Bible says it, but it, just 'cause I know something sometimes, doesn't mean that it always connects to my heart. - Yeah, yeah, you can have head knowledge, but not heart knowledge. And I would say exactly for me as well. So I went through this event. I understood who's I was. I was a son of the most high king. I was loved, valued and respected, but I still had this kind of,

what kind of man do I want to be? So that identity was almost like, okay, I'm a man of God first, but what does that look like on a day-to-day basis? What does that look like at the time I was single? And so it's like, what does a single man do? And then when I got married a few months ago, it's cool, what does a married man do, and how do I walk out that identity as a new person today? - What is some of the greatest advice you guys got through your healing processes? - That you were completely loved, forgiven, and valued no matter where you're at, whether I'm at the lowest of lows when I was chasing after sin. Scripture says that while we were in the middle of loving our sin, Jesus loved us and forgave us and gave his life for us. And so coming to Christ and understanding, no matter if I'm up or I'm down, I'm in the lowest of lows, or I'm in highs to highs, God loves me the same. In having that freedom of I can mess it up, that God loves me. I can drop the ball, I can fall into sin, but Jesus still loves me. And then having brothers to pray over me is what really brought that healing to a completion,

or at least where I can be today. - You know, Otto, for me, I had this identity of just a screw up, a fender drug addict for so long, and then I found Christ. And yes, I could hear the identity. I could see it in the book, but it was hard to take that on. I think just over time as I walked it out, it became more and more real to me that I am a beloved son of God, that I am, man, just read Psalm 139 and just speak that over your life as far as identity goes. But I now, you know, fast forward, I get into ministry, didn't see that coming whatsoever. That was never part of the plan. And here I am, and I'm finding this I need to perform. I fall into that sometimes in my thinking. And if I don't do a transition perfectly, if I don't do a, you know, transitioning out of worship into, you know, all these little things that we do up here on a stage, if I don't do that perfectly, if my prison ministry isn't continuing to grow, if I don't perform in this certain way, then I'm not okay. And that is something that I do have to fight against.

That is something that I do have to constantly be waging spiritual battle. And if you said what is some advice, it's having those people around me that know me, that know me better than I know me. When I have a situation that arises, I can take it to them because if this can represents my life, and I'm trying to see the truth about whatever situation, I mean, whether I'm mad at my wife, whether I feel like somebody got over on me on a business deal or all the things that we get angry or get thrown off about. I bring that to them. I can't see the other side of this can. I see that it says natural caffeine in this. They see that this ghost and that it says energy right there. I have no idea that it says that. I need them, their eyes on my situation to tell me the parts about it that I can't see. And that's, so I can know the truth. And then when I know the truth, now I can pray through it and I can see what my mistakes were, what my part is in it, because guys I've just found that any time I'm disturbed, there's something wrong with me. if I'm not the problem, then there is no solution. Like, when I'm having issues with my wife, it's me, man. I need to be the leader in my house. I'm the one that needs to be the environment changer. I'm the one that needs to change,

but I need guys to help me see that part. - Yeah. What was the hardest truth that you guys had to accept about change? - That I was the problem. (laughs) I mean, like, it's that thing that Paul says, "You know, the thing I want to do I don't do the thing "I don't want to do is the thing I do." And that never made sense until I realized, like, a lot of my problems are because of me. You know, I didn't step forward. I didn't do the right thing. I didn't do the Godland thing. I didn't, you know, hold myself accountable. I didn't surround myself with Godly people. I surrounded myself with people that made me feel good, but weren't people who were calling me to be better, man. And so the hardest change for me was going, "No, I'm the problem of my life." - Yeah. It's really hard to look in the mirror and say, the person I need to change is the one that's looking in the mirror. I don't need to change my girl. I don't need to change my boss. I don't need to change whoever. Everything, it's all reflective. I think the biggest thing for me with change is that I want change to be fast and easy.

And I'm very immediate. I want things now and I want it to be fast and easy. I want to lay down on God's spiritual MRI table and zap me with his gospel gun. And I wake up and I'm like Billy Graham or Mother Teresa or whoever. But the truth is that, I mean, I love football. So I speak in a lot of like football terms. But the truth is that like, I don't change is not a 50-yard pass down the field. Most of the time it's being an offensive lineman. I'm going to show up. I'm going to grit and grind. I'm going to get three yards. And I'm going to go back to the huddle. And then I'm going to come back to the next play. And I'm going to get three yards. And then I'm going to come back to the next play. And I'm going to get three yards. And I'm just going to grit and grind every single day. And before you know it, you're down the field. And you're at the one-yard line and you're pushing it into the end zone. Yeah, I had a pastor years ago. And he said, you want to make a change. Just give me 1% today. And then use that 1% for the next two weeks. And then you look back in a few years and your whole life has been transformed. But it's that.

What's that 1% change I can change today? Do something for somebody else and don't tell them about it. Serving others in humility. I found when I get out of myself and yes, I have to sacrifice time and maybe some money. If I go and do something for someone else, I find that in those moments, God is steady over here working on my stuff, whatever it is. My pride, my anger issues, my control issues, all the things that I just talked about with my brothers. When I get out of myself and do something for somebody else, that's when God is working on that for me. That's the three-yard runs, the grinding, the stuff that's not noteworthy and sexy and that's going to get you a shout-out amongst your peers doing those things. Yeah. And what you'll oftentimes find is, at least what I found, is God will actually graduate you in a big way. So using the football illustration, I'm going to get three yards, three yards, three yards, and then guess what? The defense is going to sit on the defense being the enemy. He's going to sit on that three-yard run. Guess what I get to do? I get to run a play action. They bite on the fake of the run and I've got CD lamb or whoever down the field and I get it. Now I get my 40-yard gain and now I'm moving down the field. And then I've got to come right back, three-yard gain,

four-yard gain, five-yard gain, first down. OK, so as we close, do you want to say something? No. OK, as we close, I'm just going to ask you guys a few questions. Just give me an answer. I mean, just give me an answer and a sentence or two. Eat you guys, OK? I'll try. If you expound, it's OK. I mean, I'll forgive you. But if the little boy you used to be were sitting across me right now, what would you tell him? I would tell him that God loves him so much and that he is the perfect father. And all you need is him and you. And to be OK, that is all you need. That was good. For me, I would tell him two things. One, serve the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your mind, with all your soul. And the man you want to be, be that man today. Yeah. What do you-- so if you could fast-track, if you could rewind back to a little boy, what did you need to hear in that moment that you think would have prevented a lot of the stuff that you went through? I don't think there's anything anyone could have said to me. You know, when I found the relief from doing drugs

and getting high and oh my gosh, I'm comfortable in my own skin and I can actually talk to people and I don't feel all weird and like the outsider, like I don't want to stop at that point. Nothing bad has happened. This is all good. So I don't know if there's anything that you could have told me. So my prayer for people that are still struggling is God, man, bring them to the end of their rope. Bring them to a place where they can hear, where their heart is open to receive. And we pray that for you guys as well. - For me, it would be exactly what Pastor Logan said. And then for me, the thing I needed to hear most was you were seen, you were loved, you were valued, whether you perform or not. I think that would have saved me a lot of performance, driven everything. It felt like I had to earn it. - What would you say to the man listening right now who realizes he's still carrying something from whenever he was a boy? - I would say that God doesn't want you to carry it, that there is, we're all carrying things sometimes, that he never intended for us to carry. And so I would encourage you to just sit with him in your secret place, whatever that looks like, in the facility that you're at,

to say God, how can I take your yoke upon me? How can I let this thing go? And what is the thing? - And I would say exactly what Pastor Logan said, plus. 'Cause I was like, man, that was great. What do I even talk about is, you know, scripture says above all things, guard your heart for out of that flow of the well springs of life, Proverbs 4, 23. And so as you go to take every thought captive, which is what scripture tells us, it's let's replace the lies of the enemy with what does your heavenly Father say about you. So go to scripture and find that verse that really hits your heart, Galatians 6, 9. Let us not grow weary in doing good things for you shall reap the harvest at the due time. Psalm 11, blessed is he who walks not in the council of the ungodly nor stand in the way of the sinner, but his delight is in the law of the Lord, and his law does he meditate both day and night, he shall be as a tree planted by the rivers of the water. He shall bring forth his fruit in his season, but these things are already written on my heart. So when adversity comes, when problems come, when I have that thing that just weighs me down, I go, oh, what does my heavenly Father say about me? - Yeah, but if we don't know those things, we're not gonna have them in that moment to fight with. You know, that's that Ephesians 6,

the sword of the spirit that we fight the enemy with, it's the word, man. And I'm just telling you, you need something. You don't have to have the Bible memorized, okay? But you need a scripture or two or three. I used to write on one the back of those legal pads that they give you, the little cardboard piece, just key scriptures that I could speak over my life when that happened. We gotta have something to fight with. - Yeah, so if you guys don't mind, would you guys mind praying a prayer of healing for the guys, the girls, whoever is just listening and we'll wrap up with that? - Okay, go ahead, do you want to? - Sure. - Heavenly Father, we thank you for the incredible things you're doing in every person's life. Lord, we pray that every person who hears this podcast, they hear your voice through it. Lord, we pray that you would bring healing to their mind, their body and their spirit. Maybe they're carrying something that they no longer need to carry. Holy Spirit, show them that area. Show them where to let it go. Show them where to drop it so that your healing power can come in. Holy Spirit, we pray for your anointing and your blessing to pour into their lives,

to show them that Jesus loves you right where you're at and that Jesus paid it all for you and that you're worth everything. - Yes. And Father, I just lift up all the men and women who are watching this right now. I pray that you would just let them know that just the fact that they clicked on this video today is evidence that you are after them, that it wasn't just coincidence, that you already know everyone that's gonna watch this and you are after them. And so God, I pray that they would just surrender, man. And in that surrender that they would understand that you're a God of healing, that you're a God of restoration, that you're a God of bonds being broken and that they could lay down those things, man. And I just declare healing in Jesus' name over everyone that's watching. I just declare God that your Holy Spirit will move in their hearts and their minds, God, that they will bring things up into their consciousness. Just like David says, man, in the Psalms that search me, man. And if there's anything that offends you, God, let's bring that to the surface so that we can, God, I just feel like things are being brought to the surface right now. And so, God, I thank you for that. I pray that you would heal them.

I pray that you would restore their family. I pray that you would be a provider to their family while they're gone, a father to their children while they're gone, that you would just continue to give that comfort, that peace, that love, that that your scripture talks about to them and to their family. And God, we just pray that if anyone doesn't know you, that they would just be saved today by the power of your Holy Spirit, that Romans 10, anyone, whoever, anyone who calls on the name of the Lord can be saved, that they would call upon you in their own time, in their own way, God. I don't want them just to repeat a prayer, man. I want them to have a moment with you. And so, God, I pray that you would just fall on them right now and that your will would be done. In Jesus' name, amen. Well, that was our time. - That's it. - I want to thank you guys for showing up and just having a great conversation. - Thank you. - We don't have the nice production. - Pastor Robert, for coming. Thank you, Robert, for leading this thing. You know, I just got one more question for you. ♪ Whose house, God's house, let's give 'em some praise ♪ - And before we leave, a few things. Number one, I think you guys have the ability to leave comments, I'm not sure.

So, if you can, just drop prayer requests, praise reports, and also give us feedback. What are some things that you want to see us talk about? What are some questions, submit questions? If you guys have the ability, we see comments come through. - And you can write us, you all see our address there on the Life Fellowship channel. You can write us and give us some things to talk about. Some questions that you might have. Amen. - Amen. Sounds good. - All right, you guys have a blessed day. - See ya. - See ya. (gentle music) (soft music)