God's Still Writing Your Story with Renee’ Cairns

Welcome to the Victorious Living Podcast. You are about to hear real stories of real people who have discovered the real hope of Jesus Christ. I am Christi Overton Johnson, the founder and publisher of Victorious Living Magazine. Since 2011 I have had the privilege of sharing the most amazing life stories. I never cease to be amazed at the life transforming power of Jesus Christ. Today in our podcast you are going to go deeper into these amazing God stories and hear from those who have overcome incredible odds and discover how they found a life of freedom. You can discover it too. I trust that you'll enjoy today's conversation between our host and our special guest. Thank you for listening and be sure to share the hope you hear and the mission of Victorious Living. Hi, I'm Randy Claypool with Victorious Living and I'm privileged today to have Renee Karens. Did I say it right? You absolutely did. You know, I'm very concerned about getting names right because, you know, it can be culture, it can be what part of the country you're from or accents, you know. So it's always important for me to ask. I appreciate that. Did you grow up and stay in the same area? No, I was actually born in Washington, D.C. and my mother remarried a gentleman from North Carolina and so I believe I was about maybe about 11 years old when we moved to the North Carolina area. OK, and was your mom, your dad, your birth father not involved? No, he never was involved. As a matter of fact, I was told that when my mother was pregnant with me that he denied that I was his. So upon hearing that information, that orphan mentality, orphan type spirit kind of attached itself to me. And you know how you just feel like you're not wanted. Right. And that's something that I found out much later on in life. So your your story involves abuse. Yes, sir. Would you mind going into that, elaborating on the types of abuse or defining whatever you're comfortable with sharing? Right. Basically, it was probably mental abuse as well as molestation. And, you know, as I think back, Randy, the I think the mental abuse probably had more of effect on my life than the molestation, because, as you know, physical wounds can heal. It's those emotional, mental, psychological wounds that takes years to get over. And those wounds are the ones that affected me really for the rest of my life. So there was, like I said, the sexual molestation, but then just the tormenting thoughts and words that were said to me,

you know, being you're stupid, you're dumb, you'll you'll never amount to anything. And when someone whom is a authoritative figure in your life, someone that's that you love, speak those words to you as a child, what do you do? You believe it. So I believe those words and it kind of. Shaped the trajectory of what I thought was going to be the rest of my life, who who was primarily doing this to you, it was my stepfather. And and so you what point in your life did he come along with your mom? Well, one of the unfortunate things is, as I was sharing with you earlier, my neurotransmitters were severely damaged through a lot of the intrusive, toxic thoughts that he placed within me. So in talking with my therapist, we drew the conclusion that my memory would probably be severely impaired. So there's a lot of things that I don't remember, so I believe that. Shortly after mom married this gentleman, probably that's when the abuse started. I vaguely remember some incidents in Washington, D.C. before we moved down here, so I don't really quite remember much prior to those 1st moments of abuse. If that answers your question, yeah, let me ask. about that. Okay. Um, because obviously, uh, there's probably some good in that, that you don't remember, but are there, have there been times when just out of the blue, something has brought about a memory? Absolutely. What happens, what happened? Um, again, I know this is sensitive, so I, I want to be sensitive and I want you to know, um, you know, you being able to share about this has helped so many people that are experiencing the same thing even now, or have experienced it. So what happens when one of those memories does return? Well, it used to be that I could actually feel it in my body where I would tense up and I would tense up so tightly that it would cause a headache. Um, and then sometimes I would just weep, you know, um, and then there are times when something happens and I'm triggered, I may get angry and lash out, or I may withdraw. And that was a lot of what my children experienced from me as they were growing up, is that when I got in that place of being triggered, I would draw away and I would shut down emotionally and would not be able to function. Um, and then they would translate that as mommy being mad at them or upset with them, which was not the case. It was mommy didn't know how to interact at that point. How did, uh, how did you work through that? I mean, knowing the kind of person that you have become, uh, getting through all of that, how, how did, did you go back and talk to them or explain anything or would they listen to an explanation or. Well, during the time that it was happening, I didn't know what was going on with me. There were several times that I would pray, father,

please save me from my children because I don't know what's wrong with me. And for years I cried out to the Lord, what is wrong? I need you to help me. I need you to show me what's going on. But once I got to the other side of the Lord, beginning to reveal to me all that was going on, it was at that point that I prayed and I stepped out and had a conversation with each of my girls to try to help them to understand why mommy probably was not there like they needed me to be. And they've extended a lot of grace. Um, they understand it. They knew some of my story, but not a whole lot because with your kids, you want to protect them emotionally. So you don't share a lot of pieces of your story until you feel like they're old enough to handle it. So as I began to share a little bit more with them, I think it helped them to understand why I was the way I was. It didn't change the impact that it had on their lives. That's something that the Lord had to bring healing to. But I am thankful that they have extended me grace as I tried to work through where I was at that time that I started having those conversations with them. Let's, I want to touch on two things. Um, first off, let's, let's talk about your experience in becoming a Christian. Can you describe that for me? Well, I remember it's been over 40 years ago that I've been serving the Lord, but again, there was just so much pain and so much, um, low self-worth. I just didn't think very highly of myself. So when I was approached about, you know, this gentleman had invited me to come to his church for revival, you know, and he would talk to us about getting saved. And in fact, then I just laughed, you know, get saved from what, you know, you know, how we do when we're not Christians. But something I later, you know, now I know it was the Holy Spirit, but I felt compelled to go. And mind you, I was not a church going person. We went on Easter, Christmas. So I wound up going to church that night. And I don't remember what the minister preached about, but I do remember turning to the young lady that went with me and I said, I'm going to go to the altar. And I just got up. I don't even remember walking down there, Randy, but I got there. The pastor asked me what did I want from the Lord? And I said, I want my soul to be saved. And from there is like, I felt like my whole persona change. It was like my whole heart, my whole being began to be transformed. And this was even before I started even picking. up a Bible and beginning to read. So it's like the Lord had already started that process in me. How did you know to ask that, that I want my soul to be saved?

How did you know to use that term? I firmly believe that it was from the Holy Spirit, you know, because the word says he sent his ministering angels to those that would be heirs of salvation. So I firmly believe that that was an enlightenment from the Holy Spirit. Or maybe he said something in the service about soul being saved. Like I said, I don't even remember what he talked about. But when I got down there, I just felt that's what came out of my mouth. And so that might have been an inward cry from all of the pain and the hurt. I hear about this Father God that loves you unconditionally and, you know, I wanted to be loved unconditionally. I felt like prior to that point, there was conditions on me receiving love and to know that there's a there's a being out there that loves me for me, that I don't have to do anything but just accept I wanted that. What kind of conditions, I mean, what what caused you to feel like there was conditional love versus experiencing God's unconditional love? What? Was that a part of the traumatic abuse, something that you were constantly made to feel like you the only time you were loved is if you did this, this and this? Well, I think it came probably later after the abuse with the men that were in my life. And mind you, I did not live a promiscuous lifestyle. You know, you have boyfriend, you have girlfriend, you do what the world does. And I felt like if I do this, then that person is going to love me and accept me for who I am, because at home I didn't get that. So it's almost as if you do this for me and then I'll love you. You know, you say this or you do this or what have you, and then you'll get love, but then you don't. And that's I was going to go there. That's exactly where I was going next. So in other words, you do those conditions, but you still didn't get the love that you felt was connected to those conditions. No. And I remember this one gentleman, I'll leave nameless.

I later found out that he really did like me and he really did want a relationship with me. But I was, again, so conditioned that, well, actually, he's probably wanting something from me and then he'll hurt me. So I may have what I thought at the time missed out on a relationship, but that was prior to salvation. Now, I know that, you know, our footsteps are ordered by the Lord and God has blessed me with an amazing husband. So I now know that that relationship was not of God, but just just the thought that this guy really did like me, but because I was just so messed up in my spirit, in my mind that I thought it was a conditional thing once again. Wow, just touch on the therapy aspect, going to a therapist, what what was that like and did it help you? Well, number one, I never thought I was going to end up in a therapist's office in our culture. We've always been told you don't go see a psychiatrist, you know, keep your stuff in the house. Nobody needs to know about it. Nobody needs to know about it, but you and God. And so for many years I suffered because that was my mindset. You know, I just tell God about it. I don't need to go talk to anyone else. Well, I remember one morning sitting and talking with my husband and he shared with me he was talking about things that he remembered when he was like five years old and 10 years old. And I'm like, how are you able to remember that far back? I said, I can barely remember what happened last year. He said, really? I said, yeah. He said, Renee, I think it's time for you to talk to somebody, he said, because I don't think that's normal. And you have to know my husband. So I said, well, pray for me. And we prayed about it.

And again, ding, ding, ding. You do not do that. You don't do that. But I eventually shut that voice off and I went and I'm so glad I did because we began to unlock some things and help me to process things a whole lot better. She wasn't a Christian therapist, but she was a therapist that was a Christian. So she was able to help me process some things, even spiritually. And then I recognized. is that, okay, the way you've been acting, the way you've been responding, doesn't have anything to do with you, is what happened to you. Because trauma is not so much about what happened to you, but it's what happened on the inside of you as a result of what happened to you. So it helped me to understand why the triggers, why when certain things happen, I would respond the way I did. So to answer your question, yes, it started me on a track of being able to better process things. And then there was a time period that went by, and within the last, I think about five years, four years ago, I went to another therapist to start that next journey of my healing. And that one was amazing. Some of the things I learned from that, that sadness is rooted in regret. So when we regret something, that's when sadness comes. And sadness is not necessarily a bad thing, because we all feel sad.

But when we allow the regret to take root, then the sadness comes from that, and we kind of shape our lives around it. So to answer your question, yes, it tremendously helped me. How difficult, well, how difficult was it to make the choice to go talk to somebody about all of this? It was very difficult. And again, it was difficult because you're told you don't go and talk to a therapist. You keep that stuff to yourself. And I'm a Christian. I'm actually an ordained minister. So I should be able to handle my stuff, right? I got a connection. But even through the preaching, the ministering, laying hands on people and seeing God heal them and set them free of demonic strongholds, and through all of that, I was still suffering. So I'm like, what is wrong? Why am I still suffering? I know to cast imaginations down. It's like, you know the word, God's not giving me a spirit of fear, et cetera, et cetera. However, I was still feeling these things. So as I prayed, talked to my husband that time, and I said, okay, I'm gonna submit to my husband. He's asked me to go, I'm gonna go. It was a struggle, but I went. And like I said, I'm so glad that I did.

How long have you guys been together? We, in October of last year was 35 years. I'm not trying to figure your age out, I promise. And I don't mind sharing. No, 35 years, that's really awesome. How's the journey been for him? It was, to be honest with you, it was tough for him because he didn't know what was wrong with me. He didn't know why I would shut down. I mean, we even had a period, while we were on our honeymoon, the second day we were on our honeymoon, I completely withdrew and shut down, and it scared him. But I believe because of his relationship with the Lord, this man loves the Lord and he's rooted in the word. And back then it was tough for him, but because of his relationship with the Lord, I believe that kept him grounded. So he, in return, was able to help me to stay grounded. And little by little, I began to share my journey and my story with him, and it helped him to understand. Sounds to me like you're almost giving a definition of love, real, real love. That's not just a physical attraction. It's not just, you know, there's just so much more to it. I mean, for someone to weather the storm with you and go through all of this with you, that's really awesome. Yeah, I tell everyone, I feel like I am the most blessed woman on the face of this earth

to have been given the mate that God gave me, because he has loved me unconditionally for 35 plus years. Even when I didn't feel lovable, when I was down in the aisle and I had tissue in the bed crying, he was always there. And for 35 years, Randy, he's not missed a day in telling me that I love you. See, so you followed that perfectly. I was coming back to that unconditional word, because when you found Christ, that's what you found was unconditional. Unconditional love and how incredible that you have a testimony that God can actually give you another human person to be a partner in your life that can also give you unconditional love. Right, because marriage is a picture of God's love for his bride. You know that he sacrificed himself, laid on the cross, gave himself on the cross and he laid down his life for his bride and I feel that from my husband that he has laid down himself for his bride and I will be forever grateful to the Lord for blessing me in that regard but him as well for putting up with me all those years and loving me through it. It's just, it's remarkable and I really do feel like I'm very blessed. Yes, then if you're giving advice to somebody else who's, I mean it's one thing, there's so many different categories here, you know, dealing with it inside your own home, inside a place that's supposed to be safe and a loving environment, that's so hard. So I wanted to reach outside that for a minute because I know that you're ministering, you're trying to help other people. Someone often is in an abusive relationship and those of us on the outside can see it but that person almost refuses to see it, don't they, sometimes? Sometimes and I think, again, it goes back to that being conditioned, that this is all that I'm worthy of because one of the things that abuse and trauma does, it strips your self-worth and you feel like, I deserve this.

Even though we on the outside looking in know that they are a child of God and they deserve a whole lot better than that, the enemy has conditioned their mind, no you're not. And for me, he would always point back, you are not a good mom, you are not a good wife, you are not a good employee or employer, see, here's the evidence of that. How many children do you have? I have three grown daughters, five grandbabies with one on the way. What are the dynamics, you said that you've had a chance over the years to talk to the kids and kind of fill in some blanks or try to explain why you may have reacted the way you did or acted the way you did. How do you feel the dynamics are now with you as a family, that you're giving to them as a mother and grandmother? Right. I think the dynamics are daily shifting because one of the things that the Lord spoke to me is that Renee, I'll make all things new in its time. And so the key word there was time. So I had to wait on the Lord and trust him to move at the right time because he knows the full picture. So as I stated earlier, my daughters have extended a lot of grace to me and it's been difficult for them, you know, because mommy wasn't what they needed me to be at the time. But you know, as we all as parents know, we do the best we can with where we are. So you know, I'm able to sit down with them and laugh and talk and do things with them. And it's just been a blessing. And then to have a second chance with my grandchildren, to love on them and be there for them. And even the Lord has been bringing other young women, this has blown my mind, he's brought other young women into my life that I've had an opportunity to spiritually mother. And a lot of them have recognized that some of their mothers were like, was like I was. So then I was able to talk with them from a mother's perspective and say, extend grace to your mother. You know, extend grace to those that hurt you, that you know, love you, because obviously there was something that stood in the way from preventing them from being what you needed

them to be at the time. Was there ever any kind of opportunity over all of these years to reconnect with your mother through all of this? Well, my mom passed away. It's been... probably about 30 years ago now. And our relationship, I loved my mom, and after I started going through all of the healing process, I recognized and remembered that my mom had seasons of abuse in her own life. So what's the old cliche? Abusers abuse, hurt people hurt people. And so I recognized that my mom was hurt herself and she loved me the best that she could. So our relationship kind of struggled throughout the years after finding out what dad had done. So the connection with her, I believe, was hindered because of my own brokenness. But mom knew that I loved her and I loved her. I mean, and I knew she loved me, but we just sometimes have a hard time showing that love when we're so broken on the inside. So was there ever any reconciliation to things or did you just, the things just mend to a point where they, you know, it kind of was what it was. That's probably it right there. It kind of was what it was. Mom had given her heart to the Lord and she loved Jesus. So when she passed away, we knew, you know,

she was with the Lord. And I guess I just learned how to just live with the way things were. There was a hardness there. And even in my story, after mom found out what was going on, I still felt, I kind of felt like she thought maybe it was my, I felt like it was my fault. There was always this hidden wall that was there between us and it hurt. But again, later on in life, I realized that mom had some broken places in her too. And I just said, Lord, I just wish I knew all of this back then that I might have been able to be a better support system for her, but all things happen for a reason. And he caused all of it to work together for our good. And so that's where I land. So prior to meeting your husband, you dated, you know, you tried, you know, probably had some relationships at some level. What was different with him? What caused you to just think this is different? I'm gonna go with this. Well, I didn't really date after I got saved because I had my daughter with me and I wanted to be just very careful about bringing men into her life and her wondering, is this person gonna be my daddy? I just didn't want to do that.

So I just began to pray, Lord, you know, I really wanna be married. I want Crystal to have a daddy, but if it's just gonna be me and her, then just help me to be content with that. And so I started attending a church that Jim eventually came to and he had started a singles ministry. And I started going to that ministry and we just became like best friends. We would hang out, the three of us would go get something to eat. And I don't know, he was just, he became my best friend. And one day we were sitting down talking and he said, Renee, it looks like we're kind of unofficially dating. I said, hmm, I think so too. He said, do you wanna make it official? And just everything in me said yes. And so the rest is history. And I'm not meaning to jump around here, but there was, I highlighted a couple of different things in your article. One of the things that you said was you perfected the art of pretending. Tell me what that means. It means putting on your mask. I get up in the morning and, you know, I could not leave out of the house unless my hair was what I thought was perfect. Makeup was perfect.

Every piece of clothes had to be in place. So I had to look the part before I stepped out of the house. And so I would go about my day broken on the inside, hurting on the inside, but nobody knew. And so I wore the mask and it became a part of my lifestyle. And when I got home, the mask came off and the kids saw the brokenness that the people out in public didn't see. So I believe just, you know, someone said that practice makes perfect. No, practice makes permanence. And I felt like I had perfected that art because I can. practicing it. Another one was generational wounds. Yeah, my mom was wounded because of the way she responded to me. That generational pattern passed down to me and so through my brokenness was an open door that gave the enemy access so that I could be wounded and now those wounds could have been passed on to my children, which I believe were, but because they were raised in Christ, I believe the Lord has sovereignly protected them from a lot of things and kept them from receiving wounds that they could have received had they not been covered by the blood of Jesus. See, I wasn't raised in a Christian home, so the enemy had legal access to me because my stepdad gave him that authority. So when the authority figure opens up the door to the enemy, he's gaining access or permitting legal authority over my life. But as a believer, our children were covered by the blood of Jesus and so wounds that could have been inflicted, I believe, were diverted because of the blood. So you say your story is still being written? Oh yes, all of our stories are. You know, it's like every season is a new chapter and the chapter that I'm in right now, there is just, I have never in my Christian walk experienced the peace that I am experiencing right now in my life. And I believe it's because the Lord ripped the scab off of that wound

and as he ripped it off, he began to speak life into that wound. And then I grabbed a hold of the breath of his word and I have held it in me and it has completely changed the trajectory of how I think about myself. I no longer think that I'm not worth it. I am worth it because of the righteousness of Christ Jesus. So he's still writing, still writing, and I'm wide open to whatever he wants to do in this season. And I've been kind of hesitant about sharing the deep parts of my story because it exposes my stepdad. And I completely and I totally forgave him. And so I asked the Lord that I need you to let me know when it's okay to tell the full story because I don't want any shame to come upon him. And I waited on the Lord and he began to open up the door and I felt like over the last few years have been the right season to start sharing my story with the purpose of helping others to walk in the freedom that the Lord gave me. Wow, that's a big step that you forgave him. Yeah, because the Lord forgave me. So who am I not to forgive him? My sins were many and he wiped the slate clean. So who am I to hold anybody or who are we to hold anybody in the prison of our heart? Because in Matthew 18, it talks about those that didn't forgive that the Lord turned them over to the tormentors. And so I didn't want to be tormented. You know, we get tormented through sickness and disease, broken relationships, all of these things, because we refuse to forgive. I forgave him. I actually sat across the room from him and looked in his face. And I said, Dad, I forgive you for everything that you did to me. Now I ask you to forgive me for mistreating you because I had no right to do that. My mom said he went home that night and cried like a baby. You know, so I praise God that God helped me to do that because in my flesh, well, it's no good thing. Right. So my flesh didn't want to do it. I was in opposition with my flesh. But I said, Holy Spirit, I need you to help me. And he did. And I forgave. And I feel great that I forgave. In in bringing this to a conclusion. Right now, it's you and me looking at each other talking, sharing, I'm asking questions, you're answering. But in reality, there is going to be thousands, hundreds of thousands, potentially way more than that an audience out there of abusers. And of abuse ease, you know,

people that have done the abusing people that have been been abused. And they're struggling, they're struggling to figure out their path to a different place, their journey. me, no matter where they're at. So in conclusion, what would you like to say to all those people out there? Thinking and listening, how do I get, how do I get past where I'm at right now? Whether it's the one doing the abusing or whether it's the one that's being abused or the one that has been abused, trying to figure all of this out, what do you have to say to them? Well, I think one of the things that we need to recognize is that we all have been broken in some way, and the potter is the one that can put us back together again. So I would say that we need to humble ourselves, forgive ourselves number one for inflicting the abuse, because that's always the hardest part is to forgive ourselves. But then if you're on the other end, forgive your perpetrator, because in doing so, it frees you. And then acknowledge that the father loves you. He loves you so much that he sent his only begotten son, Jesus willingly stepped out of his divinity, laid down his robes of righteousness and stepped on this earth just for you. And that to me blows my mind. So if we can just accept the fact that we have been forgiven, we forgive others, and then the release comes. And once that release comes, it's like you truly are walking in freedom. And there's, it's a whole new world. It's truly a whole new world. Renee, thank you for taking time with me today. It's a real pleasure. And I just appreciate you sharing. You know, I know some of the things are just deeply personal. But I really commend you that you're willing to put yourself out there to help others along the way. Yeah, I think transparency is what is, it helps to set other people free. The word tells us that they overcame by the blood of the lamb, and the word of their testimony. So as we begin to share our testimony, unhindered, unfiltered, Holy Spirit can take those words and penetrate the hearts of those that need to hear it the most, and help to set them free.

Penetrate, that's good. He does that. He just, he gets where we can't. Praise God, right? Amen. Thank you so much for sharing with me today. It's meant a lot to me. Amen. Well, thank you for taking the time. I love the Lord. And I just want to be a vessel that He uses in whatever way He chooses. It's not my choice, it's His. Amen. Amen. Thank you for watching our broadcast. Are you an incarcerated brother or sister who needs encouragement? Write to us at Victorious Living Correspondents, PO Box 2751 Greenville, North Carolina 27836. Or email us at hope at VLMag.org. To view Victorious Living magazine in its entirety, please have your chaplain contact us at 352-478-2098. Or email us through our website at VLMag.org. We are happy to provide our Victorious Living magazine free of charge in bulk with or without staples.