“I Tried Everything… Nothing Worked.” | God Behind Bars Podcast

I don't understand this. All I understand is everybody else's dad's there and mine's not. It kind of created this void. I just couldn't seem to feel with anything. And so when my dad finally did come home when I was about 14 years old, it had created a resentment. So I left home early. What are some of the biggest lessons that I think that you've learned personally through your time and incarceration? And it took me a long time to realize this. But God created you in a way that, of course, he wants to mold and he wants to shake, but you're unique for a reason. And I think the problem is that a lot of us try to fit in with the people that we're around, and it starts to change us. And for me, they're too spare. Hey, welcome back to The God Behind Bars podcast. I'm Jake Bodine, and it's an honor to be here at Louisiana State Penitentiary, where we have the opportunity to interview a guy that I've seen at many of our events over the last couple of years, but specifically our most recent event at the Father's Sunday. And his name's Charles Chandler, and Charles, it's awesome to have you here for me. Why don't we start back to who Charles is, and ultimately, just your life up into this point right here? Man, to start with my life, I would have to say first thing that, man, I made my life a whole lot harder than it had to be, right? So I don't have the same story that a lot of people do around here, man. My family was pretty well off, man. My mom was in the military, my dad was in the military. I can never remember us struggling, right? I can always remember me having everything that I wanted, but... So my dad was in the Gulf War when I was being born via a sat phone,

his son, which he nicknamed me Bubba, was being born. And soon after my dad got out of the Navy, my mom went into the Army. My mom was actually stationed in Hawaii. We moved around Hawaii, and then we went back to Tennessee. Going back to Tennessee, my dad decided to go to dive school. So he goes to dive school in Dallas, and me and my little sister get left in Tennessee just for a couple months, so my dad can go to dive school. Dive school has promised him a job, it lands him in Louisiana. But because of this, now my dad's gone a whole lot, man. So I was the kind of kid, I was in Tekwondo, I was in Karate, I was in baseball, I was in basketball, I was in football, I was in all these events. And I would see everybody's dad there, right? And I didn't understand at the time that my dad's handling business, that's why he can't be here, right? He's providing, right? I later find out that my dad, right, he really had it rough. Like rough to wear 50 cent pair of pants that he bought his self, right? He was having to re-wash and go to school, and some days that they wanted to even be dry. And because of that, he didn't want it to be like that for me and my little sister. So my dad's really handling business, but I'm young, man, I don't understand this. All I understand is everybody else's dad's there and mine's not, right? So it kind of created this void, man, and it was a void that I just couldn't seem to feel with anything, right? I tried money, I tried drugs, I tried women, everything that the world had to offer me. And there was this void there that I could really literally feel this void inside me. And I know now it was a longing for my dad to be there, but I was a brat, man. So when my dad finally did come home when I was about 14 years old, right, he hadn't been there for so long, right? And now he's actually trying to be a dad in my life, and now I know that's what he was trying to be. He wasn't trying to be a butthole.

He wasn't trying to be none of that. He was trying to be my dad, but I'm his first son, so he was doing what he could, right? But I was a brat, man, and I rejected him, right? And there was resentment there because you haven't been there this whole time. And now you're here, right? And it had created a resentment. So I left home early, right? I left home early and I chose to live a life in the streets. I started selling drugs, and I just started hanging out with people that I sent it of. And I just started making my life harder at that point. Yeah. And then ultimately, that's how you ended up here, right? Louisiana State Penitentiary. What are some of the biggest lessons that I think that you've learned personally through your time and incarceration? It's some of the biggest lessons that I've learned. So my mom, as a matter of fact, I have seen my dad cry one time in my life. My dad was that manly man, right? That man's man. I got convicted, I ended up getting a life sentence, and I see my dad cry, and right after that, I heard my mom say these words right here, and they always stick with me. She said, "Bubba, don't let that place change you." And what she meant is, "Man, mama knows, right? Mama knows who we are, right?" And mama knew that the heart that I had, right? Regardless of the mistakes that I have made or the actions that I've chose, right? Mama knew who I was.

And that's one of the biggest lessons for me, is to remain who you are. Don't let your situation or your circumstance to change who you are, right? God created you a way that, and it took me a long time to realize this, but God created you in a way that, of course he wants to mold and he wants to shape, but you're unique for a reason. And I think the problem is that a lot of us try to fit in with the people that we're around, and it starts to change us. And for me, it led to despair. - Yeah, and that reminds me of a friend of mine's book, his name's Damon West, and he had a life sentence as well. And it's called a coffee bean. And basically the premise of the book is that prison or your environment for that matter, no matter where you are, is a boiling pot of hot water, right? And you have three different types of people. You've got a carrot, you've got an egg, and you've got a coffee bean, right? The carrot, you put it in the boiling pot of hot water, it turns soft, right? The egg, it turns hard. But the coffee bean has the power to change the entire essence and being of the water into coffee. And we have the choice every day of being the coffee bean, and not allowing our environment to influence us, but us to influence our environment.

And that's kind of what I'm hearing through your story. Obviously, even in the free world, that's a tough, tough, tall task for a lot of people, right? Life happens, things are going to happen that are bad, things are going to happen that are good. What would you say-- how much harder is that in this type of environment to be that change agent? Man, and because, man, Angola is-- and I think it's-- I've been in nine different prisons on this sentence right here. And I think Angola takes the cake. I call this place a home of a million masks, because one day you're dealing with somebody and they're one way, and then the next day, there's somebody else. And I had caught myself in that same situation, right? The people please a trap, right? I want to fit in. I want everybody to like me. Why? Because that's the only thing that I have to base myself worth, right, is the opinions of other people, right? And if that's the only thing-- and that's another thing that changed, and I'd like to speak about that, too-- but if that's the only thing that I have to gauge myself worth, my self-confidence, my self-esteem on, then that's what it's going to be gauged on, the opinions of other people. And the opinions of other people determines who I am, and it shouldn't be like that. But in a place like this, where there's rules and codes

that you have to live by, it makes you adapt to the circumstance and makes you adapt and become somebody that you're really not. And how do you overcome that? Now I know through the blood, through the blood of Jesus Christ, and so I said that if other people's opinions of you is the only thing that you have to gauge for you, I had to go through this process, OK? So if that's not it, and I have to replace it with something-- what do I replace it with? And I didn't learn this until I experienced the love of God, and that's what I have to replace it with. I have to replace it with, rather than the opinions of other people, I have to replace it with the opinions. Who does God think I am? Who does God say I am, right? And once I really realize who I am and I is a God, it diminishes everybody else's opinions of me. It's crazy you said that you called this place the home of a million masks. And when you say that, I think it resonates here. But I also think that it goes beyond these walls because I feel that about our society in general a lot of the time. We try to wear these different masks and put a new mask on every day to try to just figure out our identity. And I look at the hurt in the world, and I look at it as more of an identity crisis. We don't know who we are. And I know that from my own life. I know that during my younger years,

when I was putting on a new mask every day, new environment, new friend group, new job desire, a new direction when it came to school, that it wasn't until I found my identity in Christ that I was fully at peace. You know what I mean? And I think that that's the greatest gift from Christ, right? It is, sure, we all focus on this eternal sentence that we're gonna get, right? And that we're gonna have this opportunity to live an eternity with Jesus. But what about the right here right now? the things that I've desired my entire life and chased money or drugs or girls to try to fill these voids that I've found by putting my identity in him. How would you speak to that? 'Cause I hear a lot of that in what you're saying up until this point, so. - That is awesome. So, man, we wanna be real. - Yeah, I think that's a big thing. In prison and our culture, we wanna be real. And it came to me as a revelation. I'm being real amongst my peers, but how real am I being, really, if I'm not really being the person that God created me to be. And that point changed my life. When I had to look myself in the mirror

and say, "Man, you're phony." Because you're adapting and you're changing according to the people that you're around so you can fit in so you can please them. But God, who's been there all along, right? What are you doing for him? And I can see him over and over again in my life. And so you asked something that was awesome, right? About that void. That void, how do I feel that, right? - What verse are we going to? - So Colossians, chapter nine. And I'm just gonna paraphrase right now. - You can read it, you can read it, you got time. - As you're looking for it, go ahead. - So it says, "For in him, the whole fullness "of deity dwells bodily," right? Just saying that Jesus is God in the flesh, right? But then this next verse, and this is the verse that changed my life. And I'd like to talk about that. But right now it says, "And you have been filled in him," another translation that says, "And you have been made complete in him "who is the head of all rule and authority." And right there, that's the void filler, right? That's the thing that I've been seeking for. That's the thing that I've been searching for. And I think that's the key, right? Because we have such a powerful God, man.

And he gave us free will, right? It's not really love if I make you love me, but what I, and this is just my opinion, I feel like we are left with that little void, right there, that God-sized hole, as they call it, right? And God allows us in our free will to do whatever it is that we want to do to try to fill this void, because what happens, he knows that in the end, nothing is gonna fill this void, and you're gonna feel this void, and it's still gonna be tangible, and you've tried everything, and that's where I was. And it gets to the point, like, I've tried everything, right? And then something like that comes, and it's like an aha moment, right? That void is for you to fill. That void is not something that I can fill on my own. Like this void, this void isn't for the world. It's for God, it's for the Creator, right? And realizing that, and that revelation right there changed my life, man. - I was just recently at a prison, and we were going around the room. You know, like when we wrote songs up here, the cohort where we sat in the room, and we started asking questions of just kind of like, "Hey, what's your view of God, and how do you believe God views you?" And one of the questions that I asked, I said, "Hey, what would be the one question

that you ask God if you had the opportunity?" And one gentleman said, "Why did it have to be so tough?" And in essence, he boiled it down to this. He said, "Why did I have to walk through hell in order to find heaven?" Like, "Why couldn't I have just found him in a church, or been taught about him through my parents, like other people? Like why did my life have to be so tough in order to discover him?" And I've been pondering that question a lot, but even hearing parts of your story, it kind of mirrors that, right? Like you said it early on, like you made it hard on yourself. How would you answer that question for that individual? - Man, that is an awesome question. So to go back to my upbringing, man, man, I believe in Jesus Christ, like I believed in the Easter Bunny, and why was that? I believed in Jesus Christ, like Santa Claus, why? Because that's what my parents instilled into me, right? I went to private school, again, I didn't have it hard. Man, my parents did everything possible, and that's why I thank you, Jake, for this opportunity, man. I've never been able to talk to my dad like this because our relationship had got better, and I didn't want to reopen these wounds, and this opportunity gives me a chance to really tell him that, but to go to your question, right? Some people are just people that I can tell you,

don't touch the stove, it's hot, right? And then other people are gonna be the people that have to touch the stove, man. In a word, it says that God allows us to go through And that's the beautiful thing about the God that we serve. He knows exactly what it's going to take that individual to get their attention, right? But again, we have free will. We don't have to love him, right? But I'm going to allow you to go through these things, right? And everything that it takes, it may take you one time. It may take me 100 times to hit my head against that wall right there and realize that, man, I can't do this on my own. I can't do this on it. So to answer your question, I believe is that that God allows us to go through the things that we go through to bring us closer to him, right? We go through just what we need to go through to bring us closer to him. And some people are more heart-headed than others. Yeah, no, I love that. Well, I can feel it in your heart right now. And part of it, I think, is because you are a dad now. And I want to get into that in just a second. But like, given you the opportunity, like if your dad was standing here in front of you today, what would you say to him? [BLANK_AUDIO] Man, I love you, dad. [BLANK_AUDIO]

And none of my situation, none of my circumstance has to do with him and none of it, none of it has to do with you. Man, you did right by me, man. You did everything in your power and you handled business as a man to provide for your family. And it was me, I was spoiled, I was a little kid. Man, I was making these decisions and I thought I was grown, but I was a little kid, man, and you just wanted to be a dad to me. Man, and I love you, man. >> Yeah, man, I know that he loves you, too. Why don't we just move into that moment of this past couple weeks in that father's son day that you had the opportunity to spin in with your dad? And you said something pretty profound, you said, you know, I used to hold a lot of resentment in my heart towards the absence of my father. Meanwhile, he was sacrificing on my behalf, and you went on to elaborate that you made some silly decisions that you didn't need to make. And your son was proud of you and held no resentment in his heart towards you and the impact that it had in you to know that like your situation was avoidable and your son showed you 100% grace, no resentment. But then all the resentment that you held against your father over him holding his business, I think is how you phrased it. Like talk about that. Like share that with the world and what I do in your heart. >> Man, that was nothing of me and straight God. I know that was a straight blessing from God because that's exactly what I needed to hear at that time. And at the same time, it was a major blow to me, right? Because again, man, my dad come see me faithfully at least twice a month, right? Me and my dad's relationship has been really good. And this is another reason that I haven't sat down and talked to him about these

old pains because it really had nothing to do with you, right? It really had to do with me and me being a spoiled brat, man, right? So I didn't really want to open these wounds. But in the back of your mind, you still think about this, man. Well, why is everybody else's dad there and mine wasn't, right? Especially as a child. So when I told Jay, I said, Jay, man, because man, I have to be honest and say that my dad did everything that he could for me. But I failed as a father, man. I failed, and I failed, Javen, and yeah, he's right. I would be there if I could be, but I'm not. And it's because of choices that I've made, it's because of my actions. So the resentment that I hold against my father, man, is not justified. But you hold a resentment against me would be justified. Man, you chose to do what you did to, regardless of the situation, regardless of the circumstance of why you did it, you chose, you did that, right? And you left me when I was three years old, when I needed you the most, you left me. And I told him, yeah, I would understand if you mad at me, right? And he cried and I was able to have hard conversations with him, but I said that that was a time of healing because I needed to hear that, right? I needed to hear that, at least you know, right? And if you are, man, you have every right to be mad at me. Man, you have every right to be mad at me. But if you are, man, I'm willing to do anything that I got to do put forth, whatever effort it takes to make everything. prayed and we got to talk about God and and he had he didn't understand the same thing that I didn't understand man why would why would Jesus die for me right and and I was able to give him an awesome answer for that also so it was just awesome man well I look at your picture and I look at the three different scenarios or I guess three different individuals in this scenario

and you being in the middle of both right it's almost like the perfect image of God's love like us in God's love right us in the middle the human condition is I want to hold resentment I want to hold bitterness that quote unquote justice needs to be served right God's idea of that is that yes each and every one of us are deserving of eternal punishment due to our sin and how we've lived our life right but it is justified through forgiveness and when I hear your son and his heart of forgiveness for your life and the freedom and the joy in the peace that you're able to experience because of that forgiveness like it tells the perfect story of forgiveness of Christ right each and every one of us can feel shame and can feel guilt and can say you know what I deserve this and I deserve that and it would be justified based on my actions but it's through his forgiveness to sacrifice and the justice that he paid for each and every one of us on the cross that gives us that freedom that gives us that joy that gives us that peace the peace that surpasses all understanding the one that then transforms our heart right and then ultimately transforms our mind to be different and to be world changers and to focus on people beyond ourselves right because the human condition is inward first right selfish I'm selfish and when we learn selfless everything around us changes and that's kind of what I've seen through your story but I also have seen in you man like you have come to a pivotal part in your life where you could easily be better at the things that have happened to you that you could be resentful for the things that have been done to you or that you've done to others but to watch the forgiveness and like you said earlier the blood of Jesus literally cover your life and how you're turning your life sentence which for most people look like a dead-end right into purpose into value and into mission field and you are having an impact in your son's life and you're transforming your family from the inside out all because of what Christ did in you and so man I'm proud of you if you need to hear that I want you to know I'm proud of you I believe that your dad is proud of you I believe that your son is proud of you and I believe that the impact that you're not only gonna have in them but on this entire population and then

beyond these walls as well that you should be proud of you and yeah man I see the the anointing and the transformation over your life for that someone that's sitting in a similar situation as you were maybe they're first time behind bars they just got there maybe they had been there for a long time but it felt the things in their heart that you have felt and they have this whole idea of Jesus is is still a is afterthought for them like what would you say to that individual so so first and foremost is is that void filler right and you can you can continue to try to fill this void on your own but I'm telling you that I have tried everything right everything it's not gonna work but there was three things that really really changed my mind right why why would Jesus first off God want to die for me and this is something that I talked to Jay about and this is a beautiful revelation right so I told you I left home early right so so I sold drugs to pay bills but there would be sometimes that I wouldn't have any money right and and what would I do because mom and dad was always there what would I do I would call mama and I would tell a mama look I have incurred a debt that I can't pay right Aaron's has got me on the phone and they're saying that they're gonna come take my furniture if I don't have such and such right and what would she do she would pay the debt yeah right so why is it so hard for me to believe that I have a father a creator right that was stepping and paid that that I couldn't pay and when I got that revelation right there it's like man I trusted that my mom would do it why can't I trust that God would do it right the wages are sent our death right this is a debt that I can't pay right and God and his love look down it was like son I don't want to see you eternally separated from me yeah I'm gonna step in and I'm gonna pay that debt You gotta believe that I did it, right? How do I believe that mama did it? Well, Aaron's didn't take my furniture. Yeah, yeah. So I believe now, right?

Because I'm marked by the spirit, man. I'm not the same person. The second thing is, when it was funny, you was talking about Ikea just a little while ago, right? So I buy something, right? And on the front of the box, it says instruction manual, right? And no, we're men, right? We don't need no instruction manual. I can do this myself, I don't need no stinking instructions. Figure it out. And that's how I live my life, right? I live my life in that way. I don't need no stinking instructions. Man, I couldn't be told anything, right? And my downfall. So what happens is, this thing that's supposed to be a bookshelf ends up looking like a Rubik's Cube, right? I have tore this thing up. And then I realize the book that I've had my entire life is exactly that. It's an instruction manual on how to live my life. But because I disregarded it, I've turned my life into a Rubik's Cube. And the third and last thing that I would tell them is that I can know the love of a mother. I can know the love of my father. But until you really understand the love of God, nothing's going to change, man. The love of God, love changes things.

And knowing how much He loves me. And knowing what He did for me. And not the watered-down fairy tale version of, man, Jesus died on the cross for me. Man, there was so much worse than that. Matter of fact, the pain was so bad on Jesus Christ. They came up with a new word, right? excruciating. And this excruciating comes from the cross, right? A pain that it couldn't even be described at the time. And once I really put that into real focus and I, man, this isn't no-- yea, he died on the cross. No, this is some serious stuff. And he did it for me. And me believing may be easy, right? Or it may be hard, but it wasn't free. God gave up everything for me. And when this love sinks in, when I understand that I have an instruction manual, and I'm not by myself, right? But when this comes in and I decide that it's just a book until I start applying it to my life. And then it's the power of God. It changes things. I love it, man. Well, thank you so much for sharing your heart today. Just even us getting a look into your life and to see what God's done in you and what He's doing through you. That's evident.

And I just want to say thank you, because it was an honor to have you. So thank you. Thank you, too. Appreciate it. I appreciate it, love you man.